Haywood Jablowmee Allthatime sounded totally convincing when he told me that he and his friends would come to destroy the New Order. We often receive correspondence from people like Haywood, people with a remarkable level of confidence and certainty. This made me wonder: Do any of these people actually make good on their threats--even a little bit? I decided to investigate.
My investigation took on a very simple form. I gathered EVEmails from people who recently threatened to take down me or the New Order, then cross-referenced them with public killboards to see if they ever got any New Order kills. On occasion, a miner automatically gets on a ganker's CONCORD mail when his mining ship is blown up, due to auto-aggressing drones. So for the purposes of this investigation, kills only count if earned after the EVEmail was sent.
So it began. Haywood, critix Beddelver, and RAPID FALCON were the first to be investigated.
KILLS AGAINST THE NEW ORDER: 0
KILLS AGAINST THE NEW ORDER: 0
KILLS AGAINST THE NEW ORDER: 0
Shadow Bird tried to organize an improvised resistance by telling other dead miners about the benefits of having kill rights on -10 characters. Maybe he thought his job was done after giving the advice. He's an idea-man.
KILLS AGAINST THE NEW ORDER: 0
I honestly think CCP needs to put something about kill rights in the EVE tutorial. Way too many highsec residents are confused about how they interact with security status. Almost every time I undock Currin Trading, who has -10 sec, I'm notified that someone activated a kill right on him.
KILLS AGAINST THE NEW ORDER: 0
I wonder if any of these people who say they'll "hunt" us even know how to use locator agents.
KILLS AGAINST THE NEW ORDER: 0
This EVEmail was a little ambiguous. I suppose, to be fair, that Jadzia Kin meant that "someone else" would defeat us. I checked on her, too, just in case she decided to get more proactive.
KILLS AGAINST THE NEW ORDER: 0
I assume "I'll tear your point smelly" was an in-game threat. After all, tearing someone's point smelly in real life is a crime.
KILLS AGAINST THE NEW ORDER: 0
Maybe the miners "hunt" us the same way that politicians say they're "hunters" when speaking with gun enthusiasts.
KILLS AGAINST THE NEW ORDER: 0
caunt Osa insisted he wasn't a highsec miner; he was a valiant PvP'er. I double-checked the killboard, just to make sure.
KILLS AGAINST THE NEW ORDER: 0
I know my history. Every new order fails--until one doesn't.
KILLS AGAINST THE NEW ORDER: 0
Honestly, I was disappointed by what I found. I hoped one of the carebears would at least get on a CONCORD mail or something while failing to prevent a gank. No dice. They didn't even go that far. We sacrifice thousands of gank ships each month, but these carebears won't help us out by destroying even one? You know, I think I'm starting to see why these resistance movements always fail.
Despite my disappointment, I invite the carebears to turn their lives around and join the New Order, so they can learn how to get kills. We can teach even the most bot-aspirancy-ridden miner to hunt the finest game in highsec: Their fellow carebears.
Finest game in Highsec, thy name is Michi.
ReplyDeleteGreat episode.
-Oink
There are a few qroups that do actively hunt NO agents. I would love to see how effective/futile their efforts are. Admittedly they do get a few pods but thats about it.
ReplyDeleteI think two things are inevitable, both of which will eventually take the form of direct attacks upon the New Order.
ReplyDeleteIt is inevitable that, as the New Order becomes larger as an entity and increasingly effective in controlling Highsec activity, there will arise some form of organised resistance from other players. We must expect this, and be prepared for it.
The movement will likely be formed around the idea that the 'freedom' to AFK, Bot, Autopilot or Anti-Tank - must be defended. Of course, it won't be miners doing the defending.
The other inevitability is the involvement of CCP at some stage. They will attempt to curtail our efforts, and in a way which ensures general support and acclamation.
At the moment, we endure empty threats of pursuit and retribution. They are indeed laughable. But I wonder whether we shouldn't now try to bring the sprawling web of New Order Supporters (those not already in NO Corps/Alliances) into some sort of organised group?
Thanks to James 315 for raising another important topic via his Blog.
I don't think there will be an organized resistance and the reason is partly what Capt Starfox said below. We've had some organized resistance before. Heck a guy in my corp used to be part of the resistance with his Griffin. Do you know what job is even more mindlessly boring and thankless than AFK mining? Its protecting AFK miners.
DeleteI once watched a guy slow boat past the "protector" of a miner in a catalyst. The catalyst got within blaster range of the Retriever and opened up. The protector, about 15s later woke up and targeted and tried to kill the catalyst. The Retriever died long before that happened. I asked the white knight why he took so long to react: Youtube was the answer.
CCP may or may not do anything. Its been a year and a 1/2 and they haven't. But the threats the rebels make are all 100% idle. To hunt us would take away from mining cycles. To sit staring at the screen ready to strike if gankers show up while your miners are AFK is simply untenable for the white knights. I for one welcome a hisec uprising against us. They have the numbers so far on their side it wouldn't even be much of a fight. But they won't do it.
Hi Malcolm, yes, I think your points are valid and persuasive. You've a lot more experience of the game than me, so I yield for the moment.
DeleteFor miners, it's all about the Isk. And the slacking. The knock-on effect of us enforcing CODE. compliance - and it always will primarily be a matter of enforcement - is that we'll be slowing down the flow of Isk to their wallets. This might be directly, by interrupting their cycles with anti-matter, or making them replace mining assistance modules with tank modules in order to prevent us.
Sloth and greed seem to be the miners' prime motivators. These traits do two things. Sloth makes them (as you point out) unlikely to form any sort of dynamic resistance themselves, and greed drives them to squeeze every last drop of Isk from their endeavours. The interplay between these two is what currently seems to fuel their anger, thus providing the tears which wash the Blog, and fostering the inertia of which you speak.
I simply found it impossible to believe that anyone would get so riled about something and then not *do* anything about it. But then, I'm not slothful or greedy.
And CCP? Mabrick once made a good point. I used to read him when I first started playing Eve, but... well.. Anyway, he reminded me that CCP is a business. They will take decisions based purely on business considerations. Sometimes that goes horribly wrong, such as the decision which lead to the creation of the Council of Stellar Management. Of course, there are CCP employees playing Eve, so they get feedback from that, too. But a business is a business, and Finance and Legal will always have the last shout.
As the New Order grows - and it will grow - perhaps CCP will be forced to look even more closely than they do at present at the balances within Highsec. And balancing is their thing. Even you say that they 'may or may not' act. You admit of the possibility (though without concern).
Eventually the New Order will be in a position to have its own representative on the CSM. The Mittani should certainly chair it, but I would like to see the Supreme Protector representing Highsec - as of right.
Proposals for the organising of New Order Supporters, Activists and Friends are really a matter for James 315. Even in the absence of a threat of organised resistance, it might be a reasonable suggestion.
Surprisingly for me, there was a lot I didn't say in my comment above. Some of it involved further speculation - and speculation, informed or otherwise, is important in generating ideas. Other parts of it were security-related. No point in handing the Carebears the Crown Jewels (peculiar English expression; I know).
So, thanks again Malcolm for directing my thoughts elsewhere. Hmm, munch munch.
Sasha
The supreme leader bottled running for CSM last time after quite a few people had put a lot of effort into promoting him. I doubt he'll get another chance as good. If he tries again in the future he can expect to face some awkward questions about why he withdrew at the last moment previously. It's a shame someone else could have run for the New Order if he didn't want to do it, but James 315 f**ked that right up :(
DeleteCometh the hour, cometh the man. The Hour is not yet; the Man is already here.
DeleteSasha
Don't defer to me too much, I've only been playing Eve for a year. I'm just obsessive. Its just in that year we've seen over and over, carebear cries, makes threats of retribution, finds out its hard, and gives up. I see no reason that won't continue.
DeleteCCP may well do something I have no control over that. If they make it too easy on the botters, then a bunch of us will no longer find the joy we had in game and will leave. Make it too easy on us, and a bunch of botters.. well that doesn't sound as bad to me, but it probably does to CCP.
WHAT A STUPID S... !
ReplyDeleteI willteach you today how to createa a successfull resistance aginst the :"NEW ORDER"
1. Be quiet, never write mails, never talk in local, never publish that, dont declare war
2. Identify your target : any Agent of the New Order
(easy just read this Blog e.g. Agent D400 & Ario Drumhall are in Uedema)
3. Identify what the Agents are doing: Ganking at stargates
(lets follow the example at Agent D400 )
4. Stop their Ganking: fit an Interceptor make sure you will have instant look , some ecm modules and wait at the stargates (better if you can place 1 of your friends at all stargates)
5. Wait
6. If any Agent show up wait until he starts fleshing red VERY IMPORTANT
7. Hurry up , target him and release ECM
8. NO GANK
(you dont loost your ship, the ganker can do nothing)
9. It will also work with covert ops frig
10. For mining belts its impossible cause there to many belts to know at wich belt they are doing Gank
11. For mining belts its possible to fit a Procurer with ECM modules, just go mining (of course make sure theres a Retreiver or Mack near you)
12. go to step 5)
Ye more people do so ye less ganks the Order will have
I would call that successfull resistance without any danger to loose an expensive ship reading your mails here at the BLOG.
People are always laughing about this s.... mails. It also dont hurt the Order.
You will be waiting for many many hours per day and we would still get our targets. Why won't you just come and gank with us instead?
DeleteAt step 7 i forgot to write: you will receive the bounty payout as well as a kill in your combat log and of course maybe an impressice reward from the possible target that you protected...
DeleteDont forget for a Thrasher you will need a Ladar Jammer and so on....
At Step 2 i forgot : you may need to know the game time of your target. Important or you waste time as Agent D35 wrote.
DeleteTo find out the game time : go to a website like Killboard. Check out at wich eve time the agents are ganking.
Additional info for Uedema & to Agent D35 : there are so many criminals (security status -10) you will have much fun if you dont met your main target example agent D400..........
Of course Agent D35 i wrote :how to to build a resistance against the New Order.
DeleteNo gank = no activity of the Order = successfull resistance
That was the lesson of today.............
Bro, I skimmed through your guidelines and most of it is something a 15 day noob could come up with. Many points are incorrect about how to properly go about it. There was a time when there was a resistance that knew what they were doing. The interesting thing was we all had a good time with them. And, I think they had a good time with us as well. Since then some joined the New Order and that opened some pretty awesome doors for them, but most quit and either moved on to other avenues within Eve, or simply went back to whatever they were doing before.
DeleteThe problem with the "resistance" against the New Order is that there isn't one. A few random white knights (Concord whores) and that's about all you got. There's that intel channel, but I haven't seen it prevent a gank. At best it gives locations of "criminals" (yellow and red.. cause apparently yellow is intel worthy) and that's it. So over the past year and a half, or so there was a cool group of rebels that left/quit/joined NO/went back to whatever vs. what you have now, a lot of ADHD kids who can't type and think if they get on a ganker's lossmail they just won the war and celebrate like it's the second coming of Jesus Christ.
You guys have soooooooo much work you need to do.
Maybe, except for the fact that unbonused ECM is terrible... Assuming you carebears even knew how the game mechanics behind ECM works.
DeleteTo anyone who want build a resistance: just follow the instructions above.
Deleteif you received first kill s of the example Agent D400
You wont read it here at the Blog.
And if you read the long answer you will understand immediatly: that if anyone want resist and follow the 12 steps. He will create resistance with a 15 day old noob
You have to create you own or just enjoy your success alone
Cause the New Order never would publish thats its possible: so i do
To the other Anon:
DeleteECM streght of 4.1 is enough to stop any Thrasher, Catalyst (is skill lvl 3)
Dont forget you dont fight the Agent D400 directly, you just prevent the Gank after hes fleshing red, the dps does Concord
If this technique works, why isn't there a linked killmail to provide a proof of concept?
DeleteI'm inclined to believe that, as Capt Starfox noted, these are just the fevered imaginings of a 15 day noob (or less charitably, a stupid carebear). Either way, probably not worth any further consideration.
Can't you just use a tanky ship with a warp scrambler or two? Sit on the gate and wait for the -10 sec guys to show up. Scramble them. Let the faction police finish them off.
ReplyDeleteBut yeah... these are carebears that whine when they lose in a pvp game, and even petition the GMs for being on the losing end of the deal.
You need to learn about aggression mechanics on gates.
DeleteIf you plan on waiting for faction police to turn up, your target will be long gone, jumped back through the gate and on a different way to his destination.
Either kill them, or don't. But don't rely on the police to turn up and do it for you.
just 1 + instant targeting in an Interceptor but dont forget Step 2 if you doesnt know where your target is flying you will wait hours and dont see him.
ReplyDeleteIf he sees that you target him he will simply warp away, a cruiser and similar is to slow for tackle. Interceptors have light increased warp scramble range and are so fast that he wont be able to hit you if you put the correct mwd inside. Orbiting at the target at range of 20-25km will also be very helpfull.
So heres a additional info.
Often the Agents using scouts for passive scan of vessels, if you identify their scouts & add them to list you may see were hes scanning . You can be sure if he find a target he will come. You dont need a passive targeter. Just a ship scan look out for for ships with cargo + passive targeter thats their scouts.
the other type of their scouts are also hauler, be carefull and dont attack the hauler if you dont know in wich way.
DeleteHe will flesh yellow cause he grab the loot of the gank.
So dont forget Step 1 be quiet. Just watch what the Agents are doing. Then you will know after 30min. what going on
The addtional type of scout is using a covert ops, you may see him using your directional scan but you wont know what ship hes using it doesnt matter.
The 12 Steps To Space Justice are all academic, the simpleton tactical reason being "without the will to win there can be no victory".
DeleteThere can be no will to win because bot-aspirants by definition are not interested in flying spaceships. They do however have a will to whine, but that's not the same thing.
The strategic reason, and again this is laid bare in the Code for all to read: as soon as any pilots set foot upon your Righteous Path they are like an arrow flying straight to Hell, and the NO will have won. If they don't even start, the NO has won. This is not a war of action but a war of paradigm, and the bot-aspirants don't even know where the battlefield is.
NO its a PONZI Scheme by James 315 to aquire ISK nothing else..........
DeleteAnother name for it is Bonus Room of James 315.
Any ISK spent by an Investor is wasted for ....whatever.....no one knows...(if you answer: for the agents told by an agent , hello wake up thats the same if everyone inside Erotica1 bonus room is telling you that theyve won so often....
Sale of intangibles
This is the epic tale of selling someone the Golden Gate bridge: someone's selling something that either has no worth, is not verifiable, or simply does not belong to them. For example BOT Free highsec
hahaahaahahah
Ponzi scheme? The money is primarily spent on ships and equipment which is handed out to agents in the form of reimbursements.
DeleteThe payment investors receive is a step towards a fully code-compliant highsec in addition to a LOT of dead miners, autopiloters and other undesirables. Money couldn't be spent better.
Do youve any proof of that?
DeleteAhh i forgot youre member of Erotica1 ahh sorry James315 Bonus room erveryone is a winner but no one has a proof..........
The only proof would be James 315 api key; sorry i cant see it anywhere..........
I'd like to just point out that while their aren't very active groups, there are people who are still willing to try and fight the New Order.
ReplyDeleteAfter idling around some gates and baiting wartargets, I had a very grumpy man by the name Bna'i try to talk shit to me and my corp.
As it turns out, he later joined the corp I had warred as an ally in some vain attempt to fight back due my status as an Agent.
He has yet to actually get a kill, and when we decided to pay him a visit today, he sat around system in a cloaked tengu avoiding us.
This makes me very sad.
James,
ReplyDeleteIMHO you should update The Code, as it currently only forbids AFK mining. Although AFK salvaging, mission running, and travelling through space can be described as "bot aspirant" behavior, it seems the people you are trying to reach have a very narrow world view, and need things explicitly spelled out for them...like children.
OMG They are coming for us.
ReplyDeleteHind the rum and my "Spank Me" mag.
Wait who's coming for us ? Did they already show up and leave.
Black
929
see there I can make short post.