Case in point: The war on bots. Every man, woman, and child in highsec knows that CCP has only banned a fraction of the bots who daily mine our ice and ore. Players report bots all the time, only to find the machines continuing to feed upon highsec's wealth, hour after hour after hour. CCP considers these reports irrelevant. We don't.
Agent Black Pedro is one of the growing number of anti-bot and anti-bot-aspirant gankers who have rallied to the banner of the Code.
Observers have called it the "Highsec Awakening". Before, empire space was home to a divided, fractured assortment of content creators. Now we are unified. And in that unity we have achieved more power than anyone in the pre-Code era could have dreamed.
Earlier this month, Black Pedro ganked a Retriever pilot named GVN in the Hahda system and found a billion isk Michi implant in his pod. A nice pod, but nothing more significant than that, right? Not until you start reviewing Pedro's past kills. Lillian Marcadie, also ganked in Hahda, was a Michi-user.
The more he dug, the more Michis Pedro found in the system.
It was no coincidence. It was evidence of a massive botting operation.
Pedro and his corp didn't give up. It was time to fight.
...and it goes on like this.
Bot-actuals are different from bot-aspirants. The carebears--those who have not yet activated the illegal macros they covet--are known for being cowardly and whiny. The bots don't normally cry, or say anything for that matter. They are known for their persistence. However, the New Order doesn't give up, either.
CCP can't save us from the bots. Only the New Order can. We have destroyed countless macro miners. As great an accomplishment as this is, we know that the ganking of bots only treats the symptom of a greater problem. We're determined to eliminate the causes: The risk/reward imbalance of highsec, the idea that EVE is a game about accumulating isk, the elimination of emergent gameplay. In short, bot-aspirancy.
Every carebear carries within him the potential for future macro usage. Once they have experienced what EVE is really about, they will see that EVE is not meant to be automated or "played" AFK. Then, at last, they will stop begging CCP to make highsec a botter's paradise.
Anyone got a link to Pedros killboard (or the one of his corp)? The one I've found on Google didn't show me any of those "supposed" kills.
ReplyDeleteDo you have it finally managed to catch real botters? After all the small, so-called bot-aspirants in a real success? Wow, respect. Better late then never.
ReplyDeleteRegards
A proud miner
We kill botters all the time. But since they are bots, they don't sperg in local and send tear filled emails. "5 Botting Retrievers Died" isn't a particularly compelling blog post. When Fawn Taylor would tell us about recently-ejected-from-their-Noctis-pods continuing to try to salvage wrecks, it was funny, but still not that great a blog post. Only the wanna be bots keep us entertained.
DeleteWhat you see on the blog is the funniest of the stories. What happens every day is the reality of policing space for the safety of us all.
No, you don't kill botters all the time, you kill players, who are afk for a toilet break or making a fresh cup of coffe. You can't mine afk with 2 Hulks and one Orca simultaneously in three windows, and you all know that. That's the way I play this game and that makes me not a bot-aspirant. It would be good for the CODE.'s reputation when more kills of script users - real bots - were published.
DeleteRegards
A proud miner
Anonymous 9:52 your defense of AFK and bot-like behavior only proves our point that being AFK leads to botting. Please, don't incriminate yourself anymore for your own good.
DeleteIncriminate myself? Really? Is that the only comment you have for my post? Poor. Your definitions of bot-like behavior and afk-mining are far from reality, but I see, you don't want to discuss it in a serious or objective way.
DeleteRegards
A proud miner
So what im hearing is is that every single miner killed was in the bathroom at the time he was killed.
DeleteNow lets me honest Anon. There isn't anything we could do that would approve your opinion of us. And frankly, we are uninterested in your opinion of us. Or as the saying goes, a lion does not worry about the opinion of sheep. You don't like what we do in a video game, login and stop us.
DeleteIf you can't see the Eve Client when doing something else, dock back up. Anything else if AFK bot-like behaviour.
DeleteYou can dress it up as you like, going to the bathroom means you should get safe in a pos or station, drop fleet if your FC could warp you without notice. It's the difference between being a team player and being a burden.
Come on it's a team game, if you can't communicate effectively play a single player game instead, or don't undock and contribute in a different way.
Actually, you can write a blog post about killing bots: http://greedygoblin.blogspot.com/2013/09/the-extraordinary-evidence-that-ccp.html
DeleteAs Malcolm said we run into bots all the time, but they usually explode unremarked. The only reason I sent in this report to the Saviour was because I thought the 1.9B ISK pod with the fifth (!?) Michi's implant might make the KOTW post. After a while exploding miners though, you get a feeling for which are bots. We have run into others like these (https://zkillboard.com/kill/39972704/ and https://zkillboard.com/kill/39972322/ come immediately to mind) that behave like this botting program. Some of these behaviours include:
Delete1) Immediately logging off after exploding or being podded (humans tend to rage, come back in a combat ship, or at least reship or mill about in a trade hub),
2) Always mine the belt systematically from one end (humans tend to be found in the middle and are more selective of the ore they want),
3) Most damningly, the other members of their corp (or NPC corp with similar birthdates) keep mining away oblivious to their comrades' fate.
4) Botters seem to infest systems in numbers - I guess once you have the macro or botting programs running there is no reason not to scale up. Groups of miners in the same corp or with the same birthdate (in multiple belts, thus obviously not using ISBoxer) are suspect bots.
But what really pisses me off is that if you look back into the the killboard history in Hahda (https://zkillboard.com/system/30003533/) there is evidence that this botter has been operating in this system for literally years. No wonder he thought it wise to buy five Michis for his bot army and stubbornly refused to move despite our continual attacks. Sure, you can argue that perhaps they were human miners at one point years ago, but if you do that you are acknowledging the wisdom of the Code, and the very real danger of bot-aspirants becoming bot-actuals that it warns us about.
Oh good. I haven't had a serious discussion on here in awhile. Truth be told, those michi implants are too damn expensive. That's why I stop at the highwall 5% mining implant.
DeleteAs for your number two, if I'm mining just to sell back to the corp, I will generally do this. However, I start with the ores that give the highest price per unit volume which seems to consistently be scordite. Then I go for either the plagioclase or the pyroxeres (whichever is in the system that I'm in at the time), then finally the veldspar. I interleave each ore type with the variant class that I'm working on. SO first it's all the +10% yield variants, then the +5% yield variants, and finally the normal yield variants.
I personally don't see a problem running a mining bot on one or two accounts. But a whole fleet? In a case like this, I find myself siding with James 315 on this one. I remember reading something awhile back where CCP banned every bot in a system that was infested with bots. They would wipe out the entire system on a daily basis, denying legitimate players access to in-game resources that are needed for manufacturing and making ISK.
CCP ALSO posted graphs representing the CPU utilization of the node that the system was located on. Before and after the mass bot ban. IIRC, the CPU utilization was consistantly around 70%. After the ban, it was LESS THAN 10%!! I'm sure someone can find the post where this was mentioned on.
One or two bots per system spread out all over highsec I'm not worried about, and it probably should be encouraged to some extent because the mass mining of belts has the effect of keeping the prices of ships and modules down. But whole fleets wiping out system after system day in and day out I have a problem with because it just chews up the CPU time causing lag and latency problems for other players on that node.
As for who is to blame for the situation? I put the blame squarely on CCP. Since CCP publishes the game, they are in charge of the player experience. Just shooting rocks with lasers is boring as hell, and it gets mind numbing after awhile. Yesterday (Saturday), I spent 12 hours mining with a single covetor with an orca hauler/booster. In that 12 hours I mined just over 1,000,000m³ of ore. I only do it once or twice a week. It's not bad if there are people around to talk to or other things to do while mining, but when you are by yourself, with nobody to talk to and nothing else to do, it really gets to you. I can see why human miners turn to afk mining and botting software after awhile. The experience just sucks. However, as I am sure that everyone who has played this game for any amount of time knows, it MUST be done or nobody will be building anything.
So James 315, this will probably be the ONLY time you see me ask this: Why don't you live up to your self proclaimed title as "savior of highsec" and talk to one or more of the CSMs and have them talk to CCP to improve the mining experience. Because the way things are going in the game, the only miners left will be the bots.
Butthurt Miner
The whole house of cards of your wall-of-text apologetic for miners "running a mining bot on one or two accounts" comes crashing down the moment a stiff breeze picks up. That stiff breeze is the breath of the Savior, as He speaks the word of the Code to us.
DeleteEVE is a MMO. What part of "MM" do botters or their supporters (even those who support only "one or two") not understand? There is no "bot" in "massively multiplayer", only "player". Again, why do botters, bot-aspirants, and their supporters seem to fail to comprehend this very simple concept?
You know, just drop your role playing bullshit for a sec, will you? I did, so what's your problem? It just makes you sound like a jackass when someone is trying to shed light on the problem.
DeleteAs for the concept that you mentioned, I understand it perfectly. The players who show up with a full mining fleet piloted by bots are doing it for a reason other than to have run. Every MMO that I have played has some form of resource gathering. WoW, Aion, and others. It's just that EvE is...so mind numbingly boring when doing it.
And that is the problem. Mining is so mind numbingly boring that it actually drives people to use bots to mine for them. James 315 and code is only addressing the symptom of the problem, not the cause. For his crusade, to rid highsec of bot mining, it is a worthwhile cause, but it was lost before it even began. It doesn't matter how many mining ships you blow up, the botters will continue to bot no matter what you do. Blow up a botter, the just come back again a few hours later. They probably have 50 Hulks, Macks, or whatever so it doesn't bother them that much. So suicide ganking a botter doesn't do anything. They just come back and then it's harder to gank them. Ganking them isn't the solution because it doesn't address the root cause of the problem.
No, code isn't the answer. All you guys are doing is pissing off the people who are mining in accordance with the rules. The rules being the ones that CCP had laid out, not James 315. In order to eliminate bots from the game, CCP needs to address the player experience when it comes to mining. It needs to be completely redesigned. James 315 can't do that. Your so called code can't do that. Only CCP can do that as the problem is in the design of the game itself.
I'm not being apologetic. I'm not making excuses. I am calling it as I see it. Now unless you are prepared to give an honest, non-roleplaying contribution to this discussion, then don't bother replying.
Butthurt Miner.
BM,
DeleteI guess if you want to voluntarily play a *game* and, rather than have fun at it, you choose to have a mind-numbingly boring time at it, far be it from me to understand that bizarre choice, but you go right ahead. Just don't do it with bots. Not only is it the right thing not to do, CCP says it is the right thing not to do, and it is a bannable offense.
But, whatever you do in a *game*, you surely don't have one whit of a reasonable point to *voluntarily* engage in an activity in it AND complain about what you are *voluntarily* engaging in at the same time.
And, an apologetic (the noun I used) is not the same as "being apologetic" (the adjective you used). Look it up, and you'll understand what I said and that I was not saying you were expressing an apology. Although they look similar, an "apologetic" is quite a different word and meaning that an "apology".
I am aLostProphet.
DeleteI am the CEO of Security Status Lowered. Due to the fact that you are deficating the name of my corp in Eve Online and say that you have chat logs. Put these chat logs were your lies are.
I am in no way a botter or a leader of bots. If you regard my corp so highly please use your war mechanic button on us and feel free to express yourself. Also Black pedro you become a clown of CODE when you join a war against my corp when we deck a corp of severance alts who are botters and this is proven my corp being set to red in CVA space for disturbing there income.
How dare you James 315, you and your pillow biting CODE monkeys attacking and killing innocent AFK botters. I should contact them and tell them all the code agent's alts that are scouting the areas so their botting software can better protect themselves.
ReplyDeleteWe are many. We are strong. The code will fall. The code will fail. A code free highsec is worth fighting for. Saving highsec from the savior of highsec, one carebear at a time.
So you support breaking the EULA?
DeleteAre you a botter as well? Perhaps that's why you're so butthurt?
Butthurt miner, new gankers will rise up and gank the bots. Trust me this will happen. Why do I know? Simple, I am a miner whos learned to gank the bots that rob me of the ores.
Deleteif you're bot is mining away, how come you're so butthurt?
ReplyDeleteSo you are admitting you use botting software in EVE Online.
ReplyDeleteInteresting.
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